A Collection of Comments (Part 2)

This article will be updated regularly with new comments.

#1 (In response to this blog)

MQTA:

What do you think about states’ rights and movements for succession? Malcom said that what blacks needed was their own nation, do you agree?

TNS:

Yes, yes I do. I hope to publish an essay on this in the future.

I think the idea of state’s rights in America has had demonic effect.

MQTA:

It seems to me like your two responses are contradictory. To me, the purpose of states’ rights is to provide greater autonomy and therefore greater self determination for distinct groups of people. The problem with one-size-fits-all government is that it is inevitably contrary to the preferences of minorities. Since every individual is a minority in some respect, it is inevitable contrary to the preferences of all people. This effect can be mitigated by restricting the scope of laws as much as possible. Since the system that works for the white majority will often not be ideal for a black minority, it makes sense that they should be able to tailor policies to their unique set of interests. This is why I am in favor of greater autonomy for distinct nations of people that exist within the United States. Can you explain to me how, in light of this, you see greater autonomy for, say, Georgians as “demonic” but for blacks as desirable? If it is not possible to give a concise answer, I don’t mind waiting on that essay you mentioned.

TNS:

Because the history of increased autonomy for Georgians has led to situations where a White mob could hang a Black woman who is 8 months pregnant up side down, use her for target practice, cut the fetus out stomp it to death then light her on fire. See: Mary Turner Or, take a Black man, skin his face, castrate him, light him on fire then sell pieces of his liver for tasting. See: Sam Hose I could list similar atrocities in every Southern state, atrocities which the federal government claimed to have no power to stop in the name of “states rights.” In every state, Blacks have either never been the majority, or, a minority of well armed incredibly violent Whites were able to impose minority rule while the national government did nothing. If we had a Black majority state now, things might be different, we’d probably still have to fight it out. But, the fact remains, history reveals there to be nothing contradictory whatsoever about by position.

MQTA:

I would argue that the examples you provided illustrate the need for recognition of a black nation since, as you said, blacks are everywhere the minority and therefore cannot hope to have their interests protected by a hostile white majority. Similarly, the people of any given state are a minority at the national level and therefore cannot hope to have their interest protected unless their interest happen to align with the majority, which is unlikely.

TNS:

The difference is that every state is guaranteed representation in proportion to its population in the national legislature, we have no such guarantee. Most states share enough interests with enough other states to be able to wield influence as a bloc. As a prelude to separation, I support creating a Back majority in five of the former confederate states.

MQTA:

If Malcom had gotten his black nation and it had been given proportional representation on the national level, it would still have had no recourse in the event that it’s interests were overridden by a white majority. Surely this is unjust? How do you propose to create a black majority in five states?

TNS:

The difference between Georgia and Black people is that that while Georgia can be overridden, there is still a sense of national unity among Whites. That’s why bringing White Southerners back into the fold was a bigger priority than making sure Black Southerners weren’t being butchered and re-enslaved. Yeah states can be overridden, but, I can’t imagine White New Jersey standing by as the people of White Georgia are being butchered, there’s a national identity which creates enough sympathy between the states to allows them to broadly protect the interests of all. Which is why I resist the analogy between us and states. Well, we’re moving back South already, in Mississippi and South Carolina we were the majority before the Great Migration, about 52% of us live in the South currently. In most deep Southern states we make up at least a quarter of the population. In Mississippi we make up 40%. If between 2 and 3 million of us move to NC, SC, GA, AL, LA and MS, we’ll constitute a bare majority, which we can build on.

MQTA:

It might surprise you to learn that the primarily white New Jersey not only stood by but contributed about 90,000 soldiers to slaughter white Georgians and their white Confederate allies. What’s more, the reason they gave was that they were protecting the interests of blacks.

TNS:

It might surprise you to learn that I am aware of the American Civil War, though I’m not sure why it would. And if New Jersey said they were protecting the interests of Blacks, they disagreed with president Lincoln who said he’d be willing to save the union without freeing a single slave and the Irish immigrants who rioted in New York and burnt down a Black orphanage because they didn’t want to serve for what many saw as a “nigger war.” In fact, it was so hard to get enough enthusiastic White recruits, that the federal government finally relented and allowed Black men to serve, 216,000 enthusiastically signed up, including 90,000 that had escaped slavery. As for the 116,000, keep in mind, that the free Black population when the war started was only about 400,000, which probably make these number remarkable in the history or warfare for a population which, unlike Whites, wasn’t liable to being drafted. But if I yet take you at your word, I struggle to figure out what happened in 1861 that suddenly made Northern Whites become rabidly consumed with concern for the rights of Black people, after 250 years of slavery, left them largely content to settle the matter slowly in the legislatures, if at all. I struggle further to figure out why this grand humanitarian impulse, born in 1861 apparently, would’ve been dead by 1877 when the federal government withdrew soldiers from the South leaving us open to butchery, rape, bombing and general dehumanization for almost a century. I further wonder, why, if these impulses didn’t die in 1877, they weren’t made manifest when Blacks fled North, seeking opportunity, and were subjected to ghettoization, exclusion from most of the labor market, predations by racist banks who profited by exploiting Black dreams of home ownership and mob violence. I wonder why an anti-lynching bill wasn’t passed as over 10,000 people (probably more, investigating these killings was a good way to be killed yourself so the numbers are sketchy) were butchered by mobs with the collusion of state governments, I wonder why after decades of Black activists, ministers and children being murdered in Mississippi, it took the death of two White northerners to get the country up in arms. The state divisions come far after and are deeply subordinate to the basic ontogeny of American Whiteness from which we have always been excluded. You grossly overestimate the relevance of identities based on state.

 

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